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Should questions that focus on the effects of ADHD on academics and students be on or off topic? For example: Survive the postdoc stage having ADHD.

And the OP has added a new tag. I'm of mixed feelings about whether to expand the wiki or delete the tag . Advice?

Technically it is a medical issue, but a lot of folks in academia are affected by it.

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    I am not sure that asking for specific types of productivity advice should be considered a medical issue. Even if it were the case, I don't think there is anything wrong in discussing questions related to performance (excluding medication), when these questions are related to someone's physical/mental/neurological condition. Prohibiting it just leads to exclusion of such people. There are questions from blind people on this website, they are not banned, why ADHD should be?
    – demitau
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 20:56
  • regarding the tag I have no strong opinion
    – demitau
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 20:56
  • My worry is that some advice might conflict with medical advice, thus I asked for guidance. I can do the wiki if we keep the tag.
    – Buffy
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 20:59
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    I am not sure what you mean. Of course if random people would start suggesting undergrads tacking stimulants every time they struggle at an exam, that would not be good. But productivity advice cannot possibly do any harm, I think. ADHD is an under-researched field in general and many of the productivity advice doctors give themselves are not very much evidence-based medicine anyway.
    – demitau
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 21:18
  • Similar questions: academia.stackexchange.com/…. Most of them use the [health] or [disability] tag, however (if at all).
    – GoodDeeds
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 23:17
  • @GoodDeeds, yes, I made a search before posting this. It has come up several times. If it is "on topic" then the tag is probably warranted.
    – Buffy
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 23:32
  • Ignoring the question of on-topicness for a moment, why not use the [health] tag for such questions, if on-topic? (Also, I think this is slightly relevant: academia.meta.stackexchange.com/questions/4783/…)
    – GoodDeeds
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 23:35
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    @GoodDeeds, I won't express an opinion on it. I'm vigilant about new tags without wiki provided and have removed quite a few of them. Added wiki to a few others. Just looking for advice here, but don't have a position. This case seemed different to me so I didn't act on my own.
    – Buffy
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 23:38
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    RE the tag, I think adding an "ADHD" tag would invite the creation of other tags for autism, depression, imposter-syndrome, etc. Better to have a catch-all tag mental-health...which we already have (it's a synonym of health, for better or for worse, but it exists). So, I recommend using the (mental) health tag instead of creating this new tag.
    – cag51 Mod
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 1:55
  • @cag51, I've replaced the tag for the moment. So adhd is now an orphan. But that still leaves the question about whether such things are "on topic".
    – Buffy
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 13:27
  • @buffy - awesome, thanks. Agree that I didn't answer the title question (that's why I only wrote a comment); let us see what others say.
    – cag51 Mod
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 17:10

4 Answers 4

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I recommend keeping these questions. School is not designed for (and often hostile to) people with ADHD, thus many underachieve and do not make it to higher levels of academia. Therefore, most academic advice out there on the internet for people with ADHD tends to be geared towards children, high school students, or college freshman. This is one of the only places I can think of that could host advice for ADHD folks trying to do serious academic work. There are a lot of novel problems that come with that which are inherently on topic.

I'd also like to push back on merging the tag with , because the experience of ADHD is very different from things like depression or imposter syndrome or burnout. It really doesn't belong with those-- and while we're at it, neither does autism. It would be more appropriate to create a tag for these, if you must have an umbrella. These are not health problems, and there are many who would be fairly cheesed to see them considered as such.

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    A [neurodivergence] tag seems like a great idea.
    – GoodDeeds
    Commented Nov 4, 2021 at 15:51
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    Many would also happily agree that their ADHD or autism cause interference in daily living, which is the DSM criterion. I don't want to get too far into that argument, but I would support the idea of separating them out from mental-health for the reasons you describe. I'm not sure an umbrella tag is necessary.
    – Azor Ahai -him-
    Commented Nov 4, 2021 at 17:29
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    For many of these mental health issues, a canonical answer would always be "See a health care professional". Imposter syndrome is probably different. neurodivergence is unlikely to ever be noticed by anyone. Normally the questions are about individual response, not how to build a better academic system.
    – Buffy
    Commented Nov 4, 2021 at 18:55
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    A neurodivergence tag would be quite likely to be noticed by the neurodivergent, as well as those interested in building an academic system that is more inclusive with respect to neurodiversity. (I do think individual tags would be better, and support their existence for the same reasons.) Regarding the individualized nature of the questions you've seen so far, I would expect better questions to appear once it is clear that they are welcome here and will not simply be dismissed (e.g. "see a health care professional") or lead to further stigmatization.
    – Alexander Gruber
    Commented Nov 4, 2021 at 20:04
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    I agree that medical advice about adhd would be off-topic here-- let me challenge the frame. I have in mind questions like "Will my academic reputation suffer if I use a double time accommodation on my quals?" or "Which countries can I not do a post-doc in as an individual on Adderall?" or "What to do when I inevitably forget to go to classes that I am teaching?" These are not so much questions about ADHD as they are questions about operating in academia in which ADHD is already a given. In particular, they require the expertise of those working in academia, rather than medical expertise.
    – Alexander Gruber
    Commented Nov 4, 2021 at 21:47
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    I'd argue all of those are primarily of interest to people with ADHD, and a tag would help them find them better. I could make the questions more explicitly about ADHD, though-- just from the top of my head, "Avoiding ADHD stigma as a grad student" or "Will it reduce my authority to tell my students I have ADHD so they don't interrupt and derail me during lecture?" or "My PI doesn't believe in ADHD and wants me to resist giving students accommodations"
    – Alexander Gruber
    Commented Nov 4, 2021 at 21:59
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    Stop treating health problems as something to be shamed of. Everyone can have health problems, a lot of thing are health problems. ADHD is a chronic mental disorder, and as such must be treated according to the professional guidelines. What you are proposing is something along the lines "a woman with painful menstruation has not an health issue, so she can perform her job without hindrances and if she claim so, she has no right". What do you propose then? that she hardens up and ignores the pain? Please explain it to me
    – EarlGrey
    Commented Nov 5, 2021 at 12:34
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    @EarlGrey The language here matters. Does predisposition to painful menstruation mean that being a woman is a health problem? You wouldn't say that women are afflicted with Female Gender Disorder. And yet neurodivergent people are labeled-- by the neurotypical, mind you-- as disordered or mentally unhealthy, despite their neurodivergence being just as determined from birth, just as "incurable", and just as essential to their identity as being female. It is part of who they are, and despite the difficulties that may come with it, it is not a problem.
    – Alexander Gruber
    Commented Nov 5, 2021 at 17:56
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    We are not anymore in the 60s. Determining someone has health problem(s), is not anymore related to putting someone in an asylum. But I understand your premises as well your defensive attitudes, however I see no common ground to further the discussion. The need of defining neurodivergent vs neurotypical (what is typical? please define it) is just the supposed-to-be-good side of a fascist attitude toward society, where there are the "normal" people and there are the "different" people. I personally think there are only "different" people, no reason to further divide people.
    – EarlGrey
    Commented Nov 5, 2021 at 20:18
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    @AlexanderGruber First of all - I'm in psychology and I think getting the phrasing right is very important. In search of finding the right phrasing, what is the difference between "something that comes with difficulties" and a "problem"?
    – Azor Ahai -him-
    Commented Nov 10, 2021 at 18:00
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    @AzorAhai-him- A "problem" to me implies that it is undesirable and one ought to be seeking to solve it. ADHD comes with certain challenges, like forgetfulness, and while someone with ADHD may develop ways to compensate, it's also possible to accept that one's brain works differently and that that is okay. Referring to disabilities as "problems" (even as "disorders", arguably) puts the onus on the individual to correct themselves and become "normal." But I think that it is up to society to be inclusive-- to provide an environment which accommodates their needs (the difficulties) without
    – Alexander Gruber
    Commented Nov 10, 2021 at 19:21
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    ...implying that there is something wrong with them. We build ramps for people in wheelchairs, provide interpreters for the deaf, but judge people with ADHD as irresponsible when they have trouble making deadlines or remembering appointments. It's implied that the ADHD itself is a problem, one that could be solved if the person would just stop being like that, and at the very least that they must seek medical help to fit into society's expectations.
    – Alexander Gruber
    Commented Nov 10, 2021 at 19:29
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    @Polyhat While I understand there is some observed correlation between lead exposure and ADHD, I find it highly disingenuous to characterize this as the "principal cause." It is also not a "catch all term," there are very specific diagnostic criteria (though I will agree that the condition is not as well-understood as I would like it to be). You sound like you have been exposed to some misinformation on this topic. I would encourage you to look into the resources at chadd.org for more reliable research.
    – Alexander Gruber
    Commented Nov 15, 2021 at 20:19
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    You will forgive me if I harbor doubts about your secret research study. I suggest that you expose it to peer review before making claims about causes or cures of conditions for which there is already an extensive body of literature.
    – Alexander Gruber
    Commented Nov 15, 2021 at 21:19
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    @Polyhat In medicine, "I've done a study that shows XYZ but I haven't gotten around to publishing it yet" is the academic equivalent of perpetual motion cranks and trisectors. If a physician really had data in their possession that could improve treatment for millions and failed to share it, they're doing the world a great disservice. More likely, there are substantial problems with the work, like with most individual research endeavors, and it would not stand to scrutiny. An unprinted study isn't worth the paper it isn't printed on.
    – Bryan Krause Mod
    Commented Nov 17, 2021 at 15:41
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Let me suggest an idea, based on conversations on this page, and also the function of tags:

A tag is a word or phrase that describes the topic of the question. Tags are a means of connecting experts with questions they will be able to answer by sorting questions into specific, well-defined categories.

So let's imagine someone comes to this site looking for help with their (a) chronic illness; or (b) ADHD.

  • Separate from . That never sat very well with me earlier.

    • Let's say person A wants to read about other people's health problems, well half of them are about mental health or ADHD (or similar), that's no use to them, or vice versa.

  • Leave for things like depression, and burnout. I also frankly have no issue creating tags for common mental health problems (they aren't a limited resource). Even if you tag your country, level, , and the problem, that's four tags.

    • I can see person B perusing this tag to see what else has worked for other people.

  • Suggestion: To encompass both diagnosed disorders1 and just general quirks, why don't we try . Again, I have no issue with creating sub-tags like as needed, so that someone who has learned to succeed in academia with their ADHD can follow it and be helpful, but not also be bogged down by every question in .

    • This can cover questions like Help with becoming overly obsessive (about mathematics), which is currently tagged , which is borderline IMO.
    • But in conjunction with you could use it on suggested questions Avoiding ADHD stigma as a grad student, or Will it reduce my authority to tell my students I have ADHD so they don't interrupt and derail me during lecture? or My PI doesn't believe in ADHD and wants me to resist giving students accommodations (thanks Alexander).
    • No, it wouldn't probably be a big follow target, but it declutters .

This avoids the issue with calling certain things "disorders" (which wouldn't be relevant for the above question anyway). This paradigm would also mean we don't have to create a fuzzy tag like which, if applied to the question above, makes it almost useless as a category when asking questions about how to deal with your own brain.

1: I'm going to use it for now because, after all, it is what the "D" in ADHD and ASD stand for. While I concede there is a school of thought (which I support) and that individuals living with these may not consider them disorders, others do and so instead of coming down on one side of the debate, let's use a different term.

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  • You seem to have accidentally posted the same answer twice.
    – GoodDeeds
    Commented Nov 11, 2021 at 11:37
  • @GoodDeeds Weird, tahnks for the heads up
    – Azor Ahai -him-
    Commented Nov 11, 2021 at 14:39
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Personally, I think that most of the questions concerning psychological disorders should be closed as dupes, and pointed to some good grand answer on the issue.

The counter to that argument would be that individuals can be helped by being responsive to their special issues. I'd counter that by saying if that's the case, then the question should be closed as being strongly dependent on individual factors.

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    So your answer to anything involving a question on this topic is it's either a duplicate, or too individual. Great! That's the site sorted, now we just have to automate the closing and go home.
    – Nij
    Commented Nov 5, 2021 at 8:41
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    @Nij I don't quite look at it that way. Rather, I think three or four GOOD canonical answers in the area, perhaps written by someone with a background in counseling in an academic environment, can help a person who needs help better than they've been served by the hundreds of answers that basically say "seek the help of a professional"
    – Scott Seidman
    Commented Nov 5, 2021 at 13:58
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ADHD is defined as a mental illness or a mental disorder, so it should fall under the health category.

Since we are discussing ADHD in relation to the academic life of a person in his adult age, I would like to add a side consideration (and somehow a darker tone). In the recent past women were declared insane during the menopause. And for this reason they were forced to go to mental institution, as late as in the 60s.

Menopause mental disorder, on the other hand, is now a recognized mental disorder (perimenopausal mental disorders, to be more precise).

Long story short: would you conisder having a menopause tag?

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    On the presumption that this is meant in good faith: if MMD was creating enough issues regarding work and life specific to academia, and generating enough questions here about those issues that they formed a considerable proportion of any other potential tag which would identify them separately, all other tags the same, then yes of course we'd have that tag, and it would be very questionable why we wouldn't use it if needed.
    – Nij
    Commented Nov 5, 2021 at 8:40
  • @Nij I honestily think that making so many differentiations is pointless and missing the point: it is not important that sickness <x> is relevant, the point is about health questions. Otherwise there is always the smartypantsy guy creeping in "hey, this chronic hemicrania the person is suffering is not a recognized mental disorder, so better the person harden up and get the work done". Plus: there is no need to disclose the specific health problem, it is enough to state that because of a certain health problem, "productivity" or "worked hours" may be less than equivalent healthy person.
    – EarlGrey
    Commented Nov 5, 2021 at 12:25
  • @EarlGrey Is it though? Chronic depression and ADHD both affect productivity in significant ways but the solutions to either will be completely different. Without that information, the answers might miss the mark completely.
    – JS Lavertu
    Commented Dec 2, 2021 at 19:47
  • @JSLavertu Is it though? the answer should be "contact a doctor" in both cases. Any other answer trying to address the medical aspects of these medical conditions without being medical-based answers, (to my mind comes a lot of good faith crap such as "raise your interest in your work" or "calm down and focus") are pure Bach flowers. If, on the other hand, the question is "I have a student/PhD/PostDoC suffering from "do not specify condition --> lower productivity " then the informations may be relevant. Unfortunately I still have to see this degree of discussion in Academia, though...
    – EarlGrey
    Commented Dec 6, 2021 at 22:51
  • @EarlGrey I'm going to heavily disagree with that. My doctor doesn't have ADHD or experience with dealing with ADHD in academia. Unless it's an exclusively "medical" issue (which it very rarely is with ADHD), their recommendations are unlikely to go beyond generic tips (exercise, sleep, etc.). From my experience, advice that specifically adresses ADHD from people who either have or deal directly with ADHD has been the most useful, definitively not "pure bach flowers". ADHD affects how one interacts with the world in ways that go far beyond purely medical.
    – JS Lavertu
    Commented Dec 6, 2021 at 23:16
  • @EarlGrey To give an analogy, it's like if tags for Python 2 and Python 3 were merged on StackOverflow. Yes, they are both part of the Python programming language, but generic answers that don't take the version into account are unlikely to be useful or optimal. Besides, it's not like tags are in limited supply...
    – JS Lavertu
    Commented Dec 6, 2021 at 23:23
  • @JSLavertu I will leave the discussion, because it is strongly hinged on the fact "ADHD is defined as a mental illness or a mental disorder". I am in no way associated with medical studies, so I cannot have an educated opinion. The vast literature of anedoctes I am collecting is that ADHD is not at all a mental illness or a mental disorder, the above mentioned fact seems to me just an assumption. Unfortunately, I do not have the intellectual means to confute medical "science".
    – EarlGrey
    Commented Dec 7, 2021 at 9:06
  • @EarlGrey Fair enough, I'm not too sure about how it should be classified either... Personally, i'd say it's more of a disorder since I didn't "catch" or develop ADHD (as opposed to just having it), but then again, I'm not a medical scientist. So there's that.
    – JS Lavertu
    Commented Dec 7, 2021 at 15:30

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